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So sweet - NZ teams

#21 User is online   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2021-May-20, 02:06

View Postsmerriman, on 2021-May-19, 19:22, said:

Um, how exactly can 3 be GF as a passed hand? (And even if you weren't a passed hand, 3 isn't GF in any form of lebensohl I've ever heard of..)


3 was GF in the original form of leb I was taught by an unpassed hand, obv not by a passed hand.
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#22 User is offline   LBengtsson 

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Posted 2021-May-20, 06:42

View Postjillybean, on 2021-May-19, 22:43, said:

Two pairs out of the 12 found the slam. B-)


jillybean. how many norths opened 2 out of the 12? east playing slam is over 50%. if bidding go 2- 2(wait) - 2 natural/kokish I cannot see how you can miss slam? only 2 opening makes it difficult to find...
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#23 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2021-May-20, 07:06

View Postjillybean, on 2021-May-19, 22:43, said:



I thought partner must have Ace for his bid, he's not doing it on Qxx
Lead = A
Two pairs out of the 12 found the slam. B-)

I will post more about this game when I get time but I will say we won both matches last night.

What else can partner bid but 3nt over 3s with Q107? Btw, the cue bid puts enormous pressure on partner to find an intelligent bid unless it agrees hearts.
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Black Lives Matter. / "I need ammunition, not a ride." Zelensky
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#24 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2021-May-20, 12:31

View PostLBengtsson, on 2021-May-20, 06:42, said:

jillybean. how many norths opened 2 out of the 12? east playing slam is over 50%. if bidding go 2- 2(wait) - 2 natural/kokish I cannot see how you can miss slam? only 2 opening makes it difficult to find...

I do not know how many N opened 2. Other than 2 tables finding 6, EW 4 played in 4, 1 played in 5, 4 played in 3nt, and once South played in 5X.
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#25 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2021-May-20, 12:39

View PostWinstonm, on 2021-May-20, 07:06, said:

What else can partner bid but 3nt over 3s with Q107? Btw, the cue bid puts enormous pressure on partner to find an intelligent bid unless it agrees hearts.

3 ostensibly agrees hearts, with QT7 partner could return to 4. Yes, I got lucky. The cue bid does put pressure on partner but we are already under pressure after the 2 opening.
Searching for your own mistakes is the only way to learn this game. - Fluffy

And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly. - MikeH

SLOW DOWN! This is not a speedball :)
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#26 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2021-May-20, 15:09

View Postjillybean, on 2021-May-20, 12:39, said:

3 ostensibly agrees hearts, with QT7 partner could return to 4. Yes, I got lucky. The cue bid does put pressure on partner but we are already under pressure after the 2 opening.

If 3s confirms hearts, then it makes sense to use 3nt as a spade cue bid rather than a suggestion of a possible contract-and that would help propel you to slam on this hand.
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Black Lives Matter. / "I need ammunition, not a ride." Zelensky
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#27 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2021-May-20, 16:15

View PostWinstonm, on 2021-May-20, 15:09, said:

If 3s confirms hearts, then it makes sense to use 3nt as a spade cue bid rather than a suggestion of a possible contract-and that would help propel you to slam on this hand.

Yes it does make sense, I don't think 3nt/3 is a suggestion to play in 3nt but does show A or K. If I was probing for nt with 1/2 stopper, I could leave it.
If partner had a void we would cue on this hand. Have I got this mixed up?
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#28 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2021-May-20, 16:48

View Postjillybean, on 2021-May-20, 16:15, said:

Yes it does make sense, I don't think 3nt/3 is a suggestion to play in 3nt but does show A or K. If I was probing for nt with 1/2 stopper, I could leave it.
If partner had a void we would cue on this hand. Have I got this mixed up?


I was just thinking out loud - that there is probably not enough room to have it both ways so the better usage is 3N as a spade cue bid after a 3S cue. I am just imagining that particular bid would be more useful than bidding 4S over 3S to show the control. If you simply think about likelihoods, the only time you would want 3S to be an ask for a stopper for NT would be when you could produce 9 tricks if only spades were stopped. That would require usually a solid minor which is not all that frequent. More frequently, I would think, would be the interest to describe a strong hand suggesting at least some slam interest. Whether 3N in this sequence should be the ace or simply any type control (including void or singleton) is an interesting question on its own.

To answer your question, in this sequence I would not take 4D to show a spade control as well as a diamond control as we are still below game (4H).
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#29 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2021-May-21, 02:22

View PostWinstonm, on 2021-May-20, 16:48, said:

I was just thinking out loud - that there is probably not enough room to have it both ways so the better usage is 3N as a spade cue bid after a 3S cue. I am just imagining that particular bid would be more useful than bidding 4S over 3S to show the control. If you simply think about likelihoods, the only time you would want 3S to be an ask for a stopper for NT would be when you could produce 9 tricks if only spades were stopped. That would require usually a solid minor which is not all that frequent. More frequently, I would think, would be the interest to describe a strong hand suggesting at least some slam interest. Whether 3N in this sequence should be the ace or simply any type control (including void or singleton) is an interesting question on its own.

To answer your question, in this sequence I would not take 4D to show a spade control as well as a diamond control as we are still below game (4H).

Perhaps 4S after a 3S cue could be the void. Is there another way to show the void and keep the auction going?

Yes, of course a 4 cue below game does not also show spade control, which answers my question from a hand today;
2:2
2:3
4:5 showing heart and first round club control.
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#30 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2021-May-21, 07:06

View Postjillybean, on 2021-May-21, 02:22, said:

Perhaps 4S after a 3S cue could be the void. Is there another way to show the void and keep the auction going?

Yes, of course a 4 cue below game does not also show spade control, which answers my question from a hand today;
2:2
2:3
4:5 showing heart and first round club control.

This gets down to agreements and with agreements it is important to take into consideration that the more complex the agreement the more strain on memory there is. Another thought would be to use 3nt as ace or king and 4s as singleton or void. But if 3n is any control, 4s becomes a free bid to be assigned a usage, perhaps exclusion with a void or a trump asking bid?
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Black Lives Matter. / "I need ammunition, not a ride." Zelensky
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#31 User is offline   Cascade 

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Posted 2021-May-21, 20:34

View PostWinstonm, on 2021-May-19, 18:35, said:

I think the only prudent action now is 4H. I don't think there is an intelligent way to find out if partner has club help, and without club help we have wrong-sided every reasonable contract option.


I have 23 hcp, partner has shown values, and my RHO has opened the bidding - albeit with a pre-empt, I really do not see what LHO can have that I am worried about that could be sitting over me.
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